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| “우리가 수도꼭지 잠그면 북한정권 내부 폭발할것”(동아닷컴)[MSNBC영문기사도] |
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다음은 헌법을 생각하는 변호사 모임의 홈페이지 http://www.law717.org 의 국내자료 편에 있는 것임. ------------------------------------------------------- 다음은 동아닷컴 http://www.donga.com 에 있는 기사임. 분야 : 정치 2006.10.20(금) 03:04 편집 “우리가 수도꼭지 잠그면 북한정권 내부 폭발할것” 미국 하원 국제관계위원회 산하 국제테러 및 비확산소위원회의 에드 로이스(공화·사진) 위원장은 17일 밤(현지 시간) 케이블 방송인 MSNBC에 출연해 “김정일 국방위원장이 군 장성들과 군대에 주는 자금원을 차단함으로써 북한 정권이 내부 폭발(implode)하도록 하는 아이디어를 가볍게 구상하고 있다(toy)”고 말했다. 로이스 위원장은 “우리가 수도꼭지를 잠그면 그것만으로 북한은 무너진다. 북한 정권의 내부 폭발을 볼 시간이 왔다고 생각한다. 내 생각엔 2개월이면(I think, over the next two months)…”이라고 말했다. 그는 콘돌리자 라이스 국무장관이 일본 한국 중국 러시아 4개국 순방에 나선 목적에 대해 “라이스 장관은 (압박 필요성을) 암시하려고 동아시아에 갔다. 라이스 장관은 기본적으로 미국의 최후통첩을 전하기 위해 거기 갔다”고 말했다. 그는 북한의 내부 쿠데타 가능성을 거론하기도 했다. “북한 지도부를 굶주리게 할 수 있는 강경한 조치가 필요하다. 그러면 그(김 위원장)의 장군들이 그를 제거할 것이다”라고 말했다. 로이스 위원장은 “우리는 지금 국제사회를 통해 북한 항구에서 나오는 선박마다 검색을 실시하려 하고 있고, 북한의 모든 은행계좌를 동결시키고 있다”고 덧붙였다. 보수 성향이면서도 조지 W 부시 행정부에 비판적인 앵커 터커 칼슨 씨도 로이스 위원장에게 한국 정부와 북한에 비판적인 질문을 던졌다. 그는 “왜 북한이 스스로 무너지도록 기다려야 하는가. 왜 동맹국인 한국이 북한정권의 연명을 돕는 경제지원을 하는 걸 그냥 두는가. 미국에 정책 수단이 없나. …한국 정부를 상대로 3만5000명인지, 3만7000명인지 하는 주한미군을 빼내가겠다고 못 하나. ‘친구여. 네 나라는 스스로 지켜보라’고 왜 말을 못 하느냐”고 물었다. 한국계가 많이 거주하는 캘리포니아 주 오렌지카운티가 지역구인 로이스 위원장은 “현재 한국인은 노무현 좌파 정부에 질려 버렸다. 한국인은 북한 지원 중단을 바라고 있다”고 두 번 반복해 말했다. 그는 ‘한미 의원외교협의회’의 공동 위원장이기도 하다. 로이스 위원장은 주체사상 이론가로 1997년 탈북한 황장엽 전 북한 노동당 비서의 해법이라면서 “북한 정권에 가는 돈을 차단하고, 대신 라디오 방송으로 (북한 주민들에게) 정보를 주입하면 정권은 내부에서 무너질 수 있다”고 말했다. 그는 “빌 클린턴 전 행정부는 경수로를 지어 주고 북한의 마음을 사려고 했다”며 “그러나 정작 필요한 것은 힘(force)이며, 대북 압력”이라고 말했다. 그의 발언은 ‘정권 교체를 시도하지 않는다. 다만 북한 지도부가 국제사회의 규칙을 지킬 수 있도록 행동의 변화는 유도하겠다’는 부시 행정부의 기본 정책과는 다소 거리가 있는 내용이다. 워싱턴=김승련 특파원 srkim@donga.com --------------------------------------------------------------- 다음은 미국의 MSNBC 방송 http://msnbc.msn.com 에 있는 기사임. 앞의 동아닷컴의 기사는 이 기사를 토대로 작성된 것임. MSNBC.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 'Tucker' for Oct. 9 Read the transcript to the Monday show Updated: 1:44 p.m. ET Oct. 11, 2006 Guests: Ed Royce, Jack Jacobs, Jonathan Weisman, Mark Williams, Victor Kamber, Stan Broome TUCKER CARLSON, HOST: Welcome to the show. I’m Tucker Carlson. We have a lot to get to today, including the congressman who knew six years ago about congressman Mark Foley’s inappropriate e-mails and he didn’t go public. Also ahead, why Newt Gingrich may be the future of the Republican Party. That’s right, it’s come to that. But first, our top story of the day, nuclear weapons in North Korea. Kim Jong-il’s regime called Washington’s bluff this weekend, saying North Korea has successfully detonated a nuclear bomb. World leaders believe it has happened and they are mad. None more so than President Bush, who called the nuclear test “unacceptable”. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The United States condemns this provocative act. Once again North Korea has defied the will of the international community, and the international community will respond. The proclaimed actions taken by North Korea are unacceptable and deserve an immediate response by the United Nations Security Council. (END VIDEO CLIP) CARLSON: Here with the latest on this developing story, NBC’s Kevin Corke. He’s at the White House. Kevin, the most obvious question first. We are certain this happened? The White House is certain that a nuclear weapon was detonated in North Korea? KEVIN CORKE, NBC CORRESPONDENT: Still not certain at this hour, Tucker. We are expecting to find out sometime perhaps late this afternoon or perhaps as far from now as a couple of days. We talked to White House spokesman Tony Snow within the hour, and he said that’s really a wide swathe. But it is believed at this point, you’re right, that at least indications would seem to indicate that this was some sort of a nuclear test. CARLSON: What are the U.S. options at this point as the White House has explained them? CORKE: Well, you can really look at it in a few ways. I mean, first of all, you can continue to call for them to go back to the table, to the six-party talks. I mean, the U.S. has already been in contact with China and Russia and Japan and South Korea, and hoping that that will somehow—you know, there is strength in numbers. That’s what the administration has been saying for quite some time. And they can hope that that would somehow encourage North Korea to come back to the table. And the other option is you could sort of try the carrot and the stick method. You know, just keep giving them little nuggets—well, what if we gave them a little more incentive, economic help or humanitarian aid? But you have to remember that that’s been tried and tried and tried in the past, not to mention the fact that Pyongyang is pretty comfortable breaking its agreements. Or you could look at a third option, and that is to attack them preemptively in a military way, but, of course, that opens up a gigantic can of worms that could be devastating not only to American forces, but that entire region—Tucker. CARLSON: This—this is almost short of the worst case scenario. The worst case scenario, of course, is war. But short of that, North Korea having its hands on a nuclear weapon, that’s—that’s pretty awful. Are you getting any sense in your conversation with people at the White House that this administration sees this as a failure of American foreign policy? CORKE: Yes. I talked to Tony about that as well, and he said absolutely not. Look, you can look at it in one simple way from the administration’s standpoint, and that is this: Pyongyang is going to do what Pyongyang is going to do. But the United States has to operate within the framework of the international community. So, as long as they have as many regional players involved as possible, as long as the international community is speaking with one voice, then the United States can say, look, we’ve done everything within our interests to try and further the negotiations with Pyongyang. If they decide to strike out and do something really reckless—if this isn’t reckless enough—then of course the United States has been very consistent in saying it will use all of its resources to defend itself vis-a-vis its allies in the region—Tucker. CARLSON: Yes. And we’ll find out in the coming days what exactly that means. Kevin, thanks alot. CORKE: You bet. CARLSON: Well, it’s the worst of all possible worlds for the Bush administration and for the rest of us who live in this country, a nuclear-armed North Korea. And the question for the White House at this point is frighteningly simple, what do we do now? (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) CARLSON: Joining me now from Anaheim, California, Congressman Ed Royce. He’s chairman of the House Subcommittee on Nonproliferation. Congressman, thanks a lot for joining us. REP. ED ROYCE (R-CA), CHAIRMAN, HOUSE SUBCOMMITTEE ON NONPROLIFERATION: Tucker, good to be with you. CARLSON: So, North Korea has set off a nuclear weapon. Isn’t this why we elected George W. Bush, so things like this wouldn’t happen? What happened? ROYCE: Well, what happened basically is that North Korea has decided that it is going to go forward with its weapon systems. And I think what will now happen is that the Bush administration will expand this—this PSI, this proliferation security initiative, and begin stopping every ship that comes in and out of North Korea, because there is only three ways they get their money: their banking system where they counterfeit U.S. dollars... CARLSON: Right. ROYCE: The U.S. has already closed that down. They get it from opium. Now we are checking every ship for opium. And lastly, they get it by sending missiles to Syria and to Iran and selling them. Now, without any form of money coming into the regime, Kim Jong-il will not be able to pay his generals. Already the system is collapsing. And I think what the Bush administration will now decide to do is exactly what Reagan decided to do with the former Soviet Union, implode the regime. CARLSON: We can get to the wisdom of that plan in just a moment, but with all due respect, isn’t it a little late? I mea, isn’t this exactly the moment that we had hoped to prevent? And now that that regime has proved it has a nuclear weapon, now we know for certain, doesn’t that give it power that it didn’t have? ROYCE: Well, let’s look at how they got the nuclear weapon and let’s look at the different approaches used. The Clinton administration attempted to give them nuclear power, the reactors... CARLSON: Right. ROYCE: ... foreign aid. That didn’t work. The South Korean regime attempted a massive bribery program in which they infused all kinds of capital, and that didn’t work. The Bush administration attempted the six-party talks, you know, with Russia, China, South Korea, the U.S., all pressuring Kim Jong-il. That didn’t work. The point is that I’m not sure there was anything that was going to deter this fellow. I have talked to Minister Yup, who is the senior administer from North Korea, the highest level defector they’ve ever had. He was their propaganda minster for the young man and for the father, and he told me they were so hell-bent on getting these weapons of mass destruction that they allowed two million people to starve inside that country. CARLSON: Yes. ROYCE: He said the only thing that will cut it off is when they don’t have access to any capital and they can’t pay their generals and they can’t fund the construction of these weapon systems. And that is... CARLSON: But... ROYCE: Yes? Go ahead. CARLSON: Well, you suggested a minute ago that that would—the cutting off of the hard currency into North Korea might cause the collapse of the regime. And I wonder if we haven’t learned in Iraq that a bad regime is bad but chaos is worse. And aren’t you flirting with potentially chaos in a country with nukes if that regime were to collapse? ROYCE: Tucker, you have a choice of how to approach this, but we cannot allow them to get a full arsenal of nuclear weapons with ICBMs. And so, in order to stop it at this point, you want the least confrontational approach. We don’t want military action there, but we want something that history shows will work. We know what will work from Reagan’s efforts on the east block in the former Soviet Union to implode it. We needed cooperation. We now have that from China. China has frozen all the bank accounts, the North Korean bank accounts, and seized the money. We’re now getting that from the international community because nobody wants to see an arms race with Japan, South Korea, Taiwan all going nuclear. CARLSON: Right. ROYCE: Unfortunately, it took this action to get the level of cooperation necessary, but now that we’ve got the proliferation security initiative in place and we are checking every ship that comes in and out of North Korea, we are on a road to creating massive instability. Now, you point out, well, what could happen inside the government? What could happen is exactly what happened in Poland, Czechoslovakia, Russia, and that is what we want to have happen. CARLSON: Well, that—that would be good. What we don’t want to happen, of course, is Iraq. But I wonder—finally, Congressman, the one thing that nobody in the region wants is a nuclear armed Japan. Japan and Korea, of course, historic enemies, going back a hundred years. ROYCE: Right. CARLSON: They are completely freaked out about this, understandably. ROYCE: Sure. CARLSON: Would the United States step in and prevent Japan from building a nuclear weapon? ROYCE: Japan is attempting right now to go along with us on this approach. What they have just done is stopped all remittances, all money from North Koreans who live and work in Japan who for years transferred millions and millions of dollars back home. CARLSON: Right. ROYCE: So they are going to attempt to work with us in order to change the situation inside the country. In the meantime, we are broadcast in 24 hours a day now with defectors telling North Koreans what’s actually going on in their country, explaining that they are the poorest country on the planet and why the human rights violations are so egregious and why they need change. The generals are not going to get paid. We need—we need to do this approach because we’ve got to used what has worked in the past. And there isn’t any other good options other than imploding the regime. CARLSON: It doesn’t sound like it. I believe you—I believe you on that score. No good options. Congressman Royce, thanks very much for coming on and explaining that. ROYCE: Thank you. Good to be with you. CARLSON: I appreciate it. (END VIDEOTAPE)
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